In light of the paradigm shift where neither Tailoring or Leatherworking creates Bind on Pickup epics, here’s help deciding between the additional benefits of these two production tradeskills.
Speculation: Revitalize and Wild Growth
Published on February 7, 2009 by Phaelia 
Analysis, Patches, Spells and Talents 
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Warning: This article is speculative (and maybe a little preparatory). It assumes that Wild Growth will be affected by Revitalize at the same rate (15% chance per tick) that Rejuvenation is. It is possible that Wild Growth will see a lower percent chance of proccing this effect, though I am excited at the possibility that it won’t.
As of Patch 3.1, the effects of Revitalize (simultaneously renamed from Replenish to avoid confusion with the Replenishment effect) will be able to proc from ticks of our 51-point group heal, Wild Growth. This substantially increases the effectiveness of the ability for a number of reasons:
- Wild Growth has seven ticks instead of the six of a talented Rejuvenation.
- These ticks occur every second instead of once every three seconds, making it less likely that they will go toward overheal and yielding a much higher rate of restoration.
- Wild Growth hits up to five targets at a time instead of one per spell cast.
- While justifying the use of Rejuvenation can sometimes be difficult, there are many cases where the use of Wild Growth makes sense.
In short, the returns go from looking rather shabby to looking OM-NOM-NOM-delectable. To update the values presented under the Rejuvenation discussion, we’ll look at the effects it can have on just one target, keeping in mind that it has the potential to hit five of assorted shapes and colors. We can use a modified 8.57 casts per target per minute (60/7-second duration) and 1.05 procs per cast (0.15 * 7) to arrive at an approximate average PPM of 9.0, three times that of Rejuvenation:
Mana cost per Wild Growth Cast = 643
Wild Growth Casts per Minute = 60 / 7 = 8.57
Avg. PPM per Target = 8.57 * 1.05 = 9.0
Mana Cost per Target per Minute = (643 * 8.57)/5 = 1102.102*
* Here I’ve divided the total cost by five targets to avoid overstating the mana cost per target.
We can then apply this new PPM value to our previous calculations by individual class:
Avg. Return per Minute DK = 9 * 16 = 144 Runic Power/Minute
Avg. Return per Minute Warrior = 9 * 4 = 36 Rage/Minute
Avg. Return per Minute Rogue = 9 * 8 = 72 Energy/Minute
For mana users, the return is again based on total mana pool, using the higher PPM of 9 instead of 3.
Avg. Return per Minute Paladin = 9 * 0.01 * MANA POOL
Keep in mind that the above returns are on a per mana-using target basis. Assuming you hit a group of well-geared spell casters with it, you could be looking at upwards of 600-700 MP5 for your raid, more than (indirectly) compensating you for the cost of casting the spell.
Summary
With such a potent regenerative tool in their arsenal, Restoration Druids may soon be counted among those players who can contribute significantly to the longevity (or throughput) of their raidmates (alongside Moonkin, Shamans of all flavors and Replenishment-providing Survival Hunters, Shadow Priests, and Retribution Paladins), and with the unique twist of restoring more than just mana. Such a change would go a long way toward accomplishing Blizzard’s stated intention to "offer [Replenishment] to additional classes, as well as make sure that existing sources of Replenishment are more equitable." And if you’re wondering if Blizzard would consider giving such a tool to a healing class, remember that Shamans provide Mana Tide Totem, and Paladins provide Blessing of Wisdom, each of which has the potential to overshadow Revitalize, given the number of targets they can effect and the relative ease with which they are maintained.
Dear Blizzard,
I promise not to (excessively) lord my Wild Growth over DPSers if you give it the same proc chance per tick as Rejuvenation.
All my love,
Phae
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*hugs* .-= Softi´s last blog ..Dum di dum di dum =-.
Loooovely.
Am I seeing an ‘enchant’ effect here. In the same way you can guarantee an upgrade drop by buying an expensive enchant for your current gear, this hits the radar just as I’ve respecced away from Replenish.
I suggest every resto Druid respec away from Wild Growth right now to make sure its buffed to epic proportions in the next patch
.
Seriously though, I was getting worried that Blizzard were talking about ‘replenishment’ being assumed in a raid and me not having it. (Come to that, my whole guild is short on the current replenishment classes/builds).
Anelfs last blog post..Hunter changes for 3.1
The talent needs to give the 15% chance to Replenish on all RJ and WG HoT ticks, not just the ones with effective healing.
Edit by Phae: Replenish can already proc on ticks that are not effective healing.
So in one patch they are going to discourage priests and druids from regenning by stop casting for a while and encourage holy palaidns to regen by stop casting?
As someone who prefers to heal the tank and not the raid (although weaving in spot heals is good), I’m still not sold.
Probably mostly because A) I don’t use WG much, and B) you can’t choose who it is applied to, so the fact that our regen won’t be going to who we want it to but to the people with the lowest health (whether they need the regen or not) doesn’t sit right with me.
If I could throw it at a particular group, that would be good.. but at the moment it looks like it will be a case of hitting the WG button whenever the cooldown is up and hoping it hits the people who will make good use of it – whereas the other classes who bring Replenishment automatically give it to the people who actually need it.
I could probably adjust to weaving in WGs in my tank healing if it’s for the good of the raid.. but the fact that my WG is random, often doesn’t hit the maximum 5 people, and is applied to people with low health, not low mana etc, so they aren’t necessarily the ones who need the regen.. meh.
Even if the numbers say we’ll get awesome returns.. WG is too random and uncontrolled to feel like we’re doing anything but hitting the button on every CD and crossing our fingers.
Really not excited about this.
Keevas last blog post..My current UI part 2: Addon list
It will be stupid if Wild Growth retained a 15% proc chance akin to Rejuvenation.
Wild Growth should be used if multiple people have taken damage and they need healing. It should not become ‘forced’ to be used every 6 seconds due to a secondary effect else we should just have a new spell to do it (have we learned nothing from the old CoH and the overly large raid buffing requirement of TBC).
Things like this should be perks or bonuses for when the spell is used, not something to push your hand into using a spell despite it not being needed.
Would it be good? yes. Would it be too good? yes. Would it be stupidly too good? pretty damn sure thats a yes too.
Keeva – I’m a little bit confused at your comment.
(sorry to psuedo-paraphrase you here, but it’s just in the interest of space and what not ^^)
“you can’t choose who [WG] is applied to [...]If I could throw [WG] at a particular group, that would be good.. but at the moment it looks like it will be a case of …hoping it hits the people who will make good use of it.”
You can’t choose who WG is applied to? When did WG somehow become a “smart heal” like chain heal? I’m pretty positive that you *can* throw it on a particular group. One party of five people can get your WG, and all five get it. In between healing the tank, you can look and see which group of 5 has the most damage overall, and then throw your WG on one of those party members (any one of them) and it will hit all the other party members too. During raids I’ll coordinate with other druid healers, and when a ton of raid damage goes out, we’ll each WG a different group, so as to spread out our heals and top everyone off as quick as possible.
I actually would be pretty cool with this change. You’re hitting 5 people of a 25 man raid all at once, which is pretty sweet – and it’s safe to say that at least one or two of those people might need some regen, in some way or another. And it’s not just mana regen – it’s rage, energy, and runic power, too, so it affects everyone. And with Rejuv, you would be only hitting one person, (as opposed to five) and that’s it, so I think that have WG affect it would help make Revitalize a more viable talent to take.
Haha, now I’m also completely terrified that I don’t understand the mechanic of WG >.< – it doesn’t, in fact, hit random people, right? It hits party members? Am I missing something here?
Avernas last blog post..Mana regen nerf?! But – but -
It’s a smart heal, getting to the 5 most needy in the 15 yard range of your targetted cast
Uh, wow. How did I not know this.
When did this happen?
Avernas last blog post..Mana regen nerf?! But – but -
Well not to bash you in the head or anything, but this spell hasn’t been in the game THAT long
This ENTIRE time I thought for SURE that it was a party heal. I’ve scoured elitist jerks, a million and one resto blogs, and blue posts everywhere, and for some reason I never came across “wild growth” and “smart heal” in the same sentence.
Omg, why is it so dark in here?! what is this stony substance all around me?!
Cause obviously I’ve been living under a rock.
Apologies, Keeva.
Avernas last blog post..Mana regen nerf?! But – but -
Well one thing to remember is that you can not learn to play just by reading blogs and forums
– they’re a nice supplement when you’re at the trainer and choosing new talents to try out.
If your raid leader puts the raid together in melee and caster groups, that assumption could be valid
Blizzard is at work making less abilities only affecting groups, only a few abilities are left in this old behaviour because they haven’t figured a way to throttle them for a raid wide effect.
Back on track, i do hope they would change this talent into being a passive ability triggered by all my direct heals and hot ticks instead. Having this locked to our wild growth forces us to look even more at the CD, and it’s a very sad change to make, if we were supposed to choose our heals more carefully.
That’s ok, Averna.
When WG was announced, I hoped it would be a party heal. At first I thought the smart aspect was a good idea – it would pick the people who needed my heals – but sometimes I really, really wish I could choose who it applies to, so I could be more in control. I don’t like smart heals very much; hitting a button and letting it choose the targets doesn’t take very much skill, and I resent that.
It isn’t even guaranteed to land on the person you are targetting – if they are topped off, it will go to 5 people around them instead. So there’s no way of actually choosing who gets it, unless particular groups are set apart (eg if melee are all bunched up, casters are all bunched up, etc – but even then it’s not guaranteed).
That’s why I’m not very enthusiastic about this change – I can’t pick who it lands on, I can’t guarantee it will land on all 5 people, I can’t guarantee it won’t land on those same 5 people AGAIN next time, and I don’t even know if it will go to people who need it.
As usual we’ll have to wait and see, but with the prospect of so many classes having a Replenishment option, and the pseudo-random nature of WG, I don’t think it is a very exciting change. At least not for 25 mans – 5 and 10s will be pretty good, I suppose.
Yea you could actually take it to the sick extreme where a bad player will figure out that he would get revitalize if he took more damage than the good player. It’s very poorly designed when you look at it that way.
Keeva, Mai – now that I’ve seen the light (>.<), I completely understand what you’re saying, and agree. (And thanks for not making me feel like a total idiot nub. Even though in this particular case, I am. /hang head) One thing I was thinking though: Rejuv still works with Revitalize as a very direct and predictable heal. Perhaps we’ll still have to use Rejuv a decent amount if we want a specific person to make use of Revitalize, and just have WG there as an added “maybe” bonus.
Mai – oh man, I can just see some total nub standing in a void zone being like, WG WILL NOW HIT ME I WILL GET TEH MANA I R SMART.
1. If someone is that stupid to think that’s a good idea, they’re (hopefully) probably not smart enough to know what WG does and how Revitalize works with WG…. hopefully. =P
2. If someone *does* do that, I’m exclusively healing them with LBs and regrowth, and making sure I’m more than 15 yards away ^.^
Avernas last blog post..Mana regen nerf?! But – but -
I’m sorry, this is like my 298342th post here (well, actually my 5th), but I have a question:
If you put wild growth on someone who is showing up as “in range” (meaning, within 40 yards), but is more than 15 yards away, will WG still hit 4 people who ARE in the 15 yard range of you? Or does it not go off at all?
Thanks =)
Avernas last blog post..Mana regen nerf?! But – but -
Wild growth will hit up to 5 players within 15 yards of the person you cast it on, i.e. if you cast it on someone that’s alone it will only be applied to him. Therefore, the spell is used to best effect on melee groups, or other instances where people are grouped fairly closely.
Also, something I haven’t seen too many people pick up on about WG is that it doesn’t have to be cast on a friendly target. Meaning? if you’re fighting a boss that does short range AoE and you have your group of melees wailing on him, then if you make the boss your target, and cast wild growth, it will successfully cast, and hit 5 of your raid members within 15yards of the boss.
How is this useful? well, its not, because your tank will probably be your target at that point anyways, so WG will his the melee group, but in the case of a rogue screen click where you end up clicking the boss (because, you know, that guy does take up a pretty large portion of the screen) you won’t have to panic to find a target in the mass up there and you should be OK.
As for the actual topic at hand – I agree with Mayfax. This change will have people casting wild growth on groups that are at full life, just because they get a kick ass buff that regens a lot more mana for a group than it does to cast in the first place. You shouldn’t be blowing your 6sec cooldown on someone unless they need the life.
I think this entire talent needs to be reworked by blizzard. They need to first figure out what they want this talent to do. Do they want it to help regen the stuff all the classes use for their abilities? Maybe they could make it an aura put off by our tree with a certain radius, and its proc chance increases with more talents, or the range increases with talents, or both. Or do they want this to just be a low # of targets kind of thing? Then they could add it to lifebloom, and let the proc chance increase with the number on the stack.
Whatever the case, I think they need to start from ground zero with this talent and figure out what it is exactly that they want it to do.
Thing is, warlocks and mages are getting replenish as well…
This change will not make me specc WG, the top resto tree is still very bad compared to what i get from the balance tree.
The resto tree died after improved tree of life.
Just compare shamans, paladins and priests top healing talents and tell me how the lack luster druid ones compare to them.
Just a clarification on your Mana Tide comment … all of the shaman water totems (Mana/Healing Spring, Mana Tide, and the Poison/Disease Cleansing totems) only affect the shaman’s party, they are not raid-wide buffs unlike the rest of the totems. So while the Mana Tide is pretty potent (24% of the caster’s mana pool refreshed every 5 minutes), it provides *much* less mana to the raid than Replenishment does.